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Transcript of 10/5/2005 KLBJ Second Interview with

William Gibson Regarding Tom DeLay Indictment

Mark Caesar:            …8:40 at KLBJ, Good Morning I'm Mark Caesar with Ed Clements and Sergeant Sam Cox, we're here every weekday morning 5:30 -10 joining us on the KLBJ news liveline is Mr. William Gibson.  He was the foreperson of the grand jury that indicted Tom DeLay on the conspiracy charges.  Welcome back to KLBJ Mr. Gibson.  Good Morning.  Are you there Mr. Gibson?  We have him up.  Try to get him connected there.  We had him on hold just a second ago.

Ed Clements:            Yeah, Mr. Gibson, are you there sir?

MC:            Pop that down so Ryan can get him on the line with him and see what is going on.  He was on with us last week and we're inviting him back this morning because of the reports in the paper that he and the other member of the first grand jury were telephoned by the DA's office over the weekend to gain their opinion on this new evidence that emerged in the Tom DeLay case. 

EC:            Right.  We've discussed this with Dick DeGuerin and Dick DeGuerin has said what is that new evidence.  We'd like to know what the new evidence is.  Mr. Gibson, welcome back to KLBJ.  Are you there sir?

William Gibson:            I'm here sir. 

EC:            Yes, sir.  Now, could you tell us about your conversation you had with the DA's office this weekend.  Did they call you and what was the focus of the discussion with you? 

WG:            I cannot comment on that.  I noticed somebody called me and said that it was in the paper this morning, but I haven't read the paper this morning, but I cannot comment on that. 

MC:                        Did they talk with you by phone?

WG:            No. 

MC:            They did not. 

WG:                        I was not contacted by the District Attorney's office. 

MC:                        Not over the weekend.  No one in the DA's office did.

WG:                        [Inaudible]…. I have no comment on that, sir

MC:                        Why's that?

WG:                        [inaudible].. . because people have told me about the newspaper. 

MC:                        Say that again Mr. Gibson, I'm sorry?

WG:                        I have not read the newspaper.  Somebody called me and told me it was all over the paper on Thursday, but no, as far as being contacted this weekend by Mr. Earle, I cannot comment on that or his office personnel, I cannot comment on that. . . [inaudible]

Sam Cox:            Well, you are not a sitting grand juror?

WG:                        No, I'm not, but I feel like uh, I better not comment on that. 

MC:                        Did they ask you not to talk to the media about it?

WG:                        No, that's one thing Mr. Earle and staff had said that we were free to talk to the media if we wanted to.  That the media was a very good source of information for everybody. 

MC:                        Yes, and there are many other cases in the past where grand jury members have talked with the media after their term on the grand jury has expired.

SC:                        Well, there is one thing I can ask you that will not violate the terms of being a good grand juror.  Did they discuss with you new evidence that you weren't aware of?  That's not saying what the evidence is.  That's not divulging anything other than what Ronnie Earle himself has said.  He said he had new evidence. 

MC:                        Yeah, in his official statement.

EC:                        Yeah

WG:            Well, [inaudible]. .. new evidence?

MC and EC:              Yes, sir.

WG:              check with the grand jury that had indicted Mr. DeLay.

SC:            Yes.  Ronnie Earle himself said that he polled all of you guys to see if you would return an indictment if you had the new evidence in your mind, would you indict?

WG:            Right.  Well, if Mr. Earle said that.  I think I would be free to say that we were contacted, but will not divulge what we told him how we felt about the deal, but he just told us that he had new evidence from what they tell me the papers said. 

SC:            So, he did tell you about new evidence. 

WG:            Yes, we were contacted.

MC:            Mr. Gibson, as you follow all of this, is there anything that you feel needs to be cleared up for the public, for the good of the public, is there something missing out of all of this or something that you thinks needs to be mentioned?  

WG:            Well, the only thing I can say is that we were presented with enough evidence with the grand jury I was foreman of, to return the indictment.  I believe Mr. Earle has said that there may be other new evidence or other things coming.  This is after … I left.  . . .what he was talking about.

MC:            Okay.  Mr. Gibson, again thanks for your time this morning. 

WG:            I apologize from …..  I am one of those people suffering from the effects of the weather. 

*The ragweed, too.

MC:              That’s alright.  We hope you get to feeling better soon.

WG:            Let me tell you.  One thing lets talking about disclosing evidence.  How would, how the people would have voted.

EC:            How the grand jury would have voted, yes sir?

WG:            This is in respect to the information that was put out as to the ads that were coming out.  Those ads were . . .pay for everyone elses paper.  That's what I was commenting on.  I had looked at those ad, not from evidence within the grand jury, but from reading your paper and all the other papers that had pictures of those so called ads in them. [inaudible] on the grand jury, they were telling people how to vote.  This was before I ever got on the grand jury, but then  [inaudible] I looked at those things until today and those, they were telling people how to vote. 

MC:            Now, which ads are these, Mr. Gibson?

WG:            Those were the ones referred to in the paper by the CAB. [inaudible] in you local paper.  it was telling people how to vote. [inaudible] by the so called freedom of speech they were putting something in the paper for people to look at and let them make their decision. 

MC:            Okay

WG:            But looking at those ads, people with average intelligence could tell what they was there for. 

MC:            Alright, Texas Association of Business ads.

WG:            I was exposed to those before I was ever on the grand jury because I looked at those because a friend of mine was involved in those advertisement.  [inaudible]

MC:            What was his role in those ads?

WC:            [inaudible] that they did not think he would be a good candidate.  [inaudible] He's a local man here.  He's a real fine fellow.  They just stated.  [inaudible] hey, you would not want this person representing you, . . doing this, this and everything. If that's telling a person how to vote, I don't know what is. 

MC:            Okay, in those legislative races?

WG:            Yeah, this all came out before I ever was on the grand jury.  [inaudible] Austin paper, and everybody elses paper, they were flooded market around here

MC:            Alright, Mr.

WG:            [inaudible]  those were way before I was on the grand jury.  My decision was based on those, not based on what might have happened in grand jury room.

MC:            Oh, okay.  So, your mind was made up after you learned about the ads.

WG:            yeah, those ads way back there was telling people how their so called freedom of speech deal., but I look at it today. .they were just trying to . . . don't vote for that person, don't vote for person. 

MC:            So, they didn't have to persuade you in the grand jury with any evidence?  You already

WG:            No. that was already public knowledge there.  That's was way back . . . that was not freedom of speech , but rechon telling somebody how to vote. They were  stating their position and I could state my position by hey don't like that. 

MC:            Alright, Mr. Gibson, again Thank you.  We hope you get to feeling better soon, sir. 

WG:            Thank you, sir very much. 

MC:            Alright. Take care.  I hope you get over that cold. 

MC:            William Gibson.  He was the foreman of the first grand jury.  That’s grand jury number one that returned the indictment of conspiracy

EC:            Last week.

MC:            Yes.

EC:            Last week, not to be confused with the one they did on Monday. 

SC:            Whoo.  Almost have to start keeping a score card.